Apologies

topic posted Thu, July 3, 2008 - 6:57 AM by  Edward
Apologies are tricky. Emotions are high, everyone's a little hot under the collar, egos are bruised, and everything feels a wee bit tense, balanced on a needle's tip and wibbly-wobbly.

And, somehow, in the middle of that, Someone owes Someone Else an apology.

What are your thoughts on apologies? How does one successfully navigate such potentially treacherous waters safely? What tools, tips, or techniques have helped you do this? What assumptions or mistakes have you made and hope to or have corrected in future occurrences? Is there a difference between "I'm sorry" and "I apologize"? Is there a difference between what we learned about apologizing as little kids versus what we do as adults? What works? What doesn't? Why? Why not?
posted by:
Edward
  • Re: Apologies

    Thu, July 3, 2008 - 7:57 AM
    I've found that for me, apologizing IMMEDIATELY (if that's at all feasible) when I realize I screwed up helps a lot. It helps to make less of a production of it, and conveys the genuine sincerity better.

    I live with an ex husband. We're friends now, but let's be frank: Exes are often exes because they weren't treating each other right. (Not the only reason mind, but it is often *a* reason).

    I know for myself, I had some verbal habits of communication with him that were just... NOT how I really want to treat people, especially someone I want as a friend.

    So. every time I'd snap at him, when I caught myself, I'd just take a deep breath and say something along the lines of, "I was wrong to speak to you like that. I'm trying to stop it. I hope you'll forgive me. I want to be more respectful when I speak to you."

    Because that intention was real --AND BACKED BY VERIFIABLE ACTION, the sincerity showed. And I stopped snapping as often and speaking more respectfully.

    It worked out well, and I think the lesson I took away from it was that my actions must show that I'm somewhere in the process of correcting the wrong.
    • Re: Apologies

      Thu, July 3, 2008 - 8:38 AM
      Apologies mean a lot more to me when there are actions that reinforce them. You can say "I'm sorry" all you want but until you make an effort to stop the behavior that you're apologizing for you're 'sorry' isn't worth the paper it's written on.

      For Pete's sake, if someone has apologized to you don't brow beat them about what they did wrong. No one likes to be treated like a puppy that pooed on the carpet. If you need conformation that they are truly sorry then look for it in their actions.

      And if I find myself in the position of offering an apology then I try to do it as soon as I have realized my mistake and I'm specific about what I'm apologizing for. I don't defend my actions, I try to just offer a pure apology.
      • Re: Apologies

        Thu, July 3, 2008 - 12:58 PM
        Heh, a friend of mine has an agreement w/ her partner about the "apology dance." There's this ridiculous dance, not unlike the "I have to pee" dance, where the person bobs around and apologizes profusely for being a terrible horrible schmuck, and once they're done the other person can never ever bring up that mistake again.
    • Re: Apologies

      Thu, July 3, 2008 - 8:59 AM
      I agree wholeheartedly Noel.

      Sincere regret and a willingness to take responsibility for personal growth and change are key. It also reminds me of a previous post about blaming - there is no enemy, we're all people with human frailties, trying our best (usually anyway) to navigate life's vast and unpredictable oceans.
      • Re: Apologies

        Thu, July 3, 2008 - 12:07 PM
        An apology should never include words like but, because or although...I'm sorry I threw the vase, but it was because...tuned you out at the word but.
        • Re: Apologies

          Fri, July 4, 2008 - 6:12 PM
          "An apology should never include words like but, because or although...I'm sorry I threw the vase, but it was because...tuned you out at the word but."

          Hm. Well, most of the time, if it's at all possible, I like to know the reasons why things happened. That way, in case I was a contributor somehow, I can fix it later. I hunger for data. 8)

          But to each their own.
  • Re: Apologies

    Thu, July 3, 2008 - 8:28 AM
    Good timing Edward!

    My partner and I had a similar, yet different, discussion yesterday.

    There's "I'm sorry your garden is struggling" which is totally different from "I sorry I stomped on your prize petunias". The first can sometimes be mistaken for some kind of acceptance of responsibility when it is really just a commiseration. Being clear about what is intended by the "I'm sorry" is important and probably requires different language.

    The distinction that you make, and Noel's example expresses so well, is that "I apologize" is far clearer language. It takes clear responsibility. Add to that a resolve to work differently, and you've got a good apology.

    "I apologize that I stomped on your prize petunias -- I'll try to stop chasing fireflies through the garden at night. Can I buy you some new ones?"

    My stbx is not good at apologies and they often arrive in the form of shifted blame. What happens there, however, is that I end up feeling like I have to shoulder the responsibility (don't ask why -- that's for me and my therapist to work out). So those wibbly wobbly, needle's tip feelings end up unresolved, amplified, and engrained.

    Making appropriate apologies quickly, and taking appropriate action to resolve the situation, and making amends, is like pulling out a sliver. It hurts like heck but it feels so much better afterwards.




  • Re: Apologies

    Thu, July 3, 2008 - 8:48 AM
    I thought I'd post this thought separately...

    You ask a really good question about kids too.

    We say to kids "Say you're sorry" and we tend to demand that they do it . The problem is you get insincere apologies. What the kids learn is to say "I'm sorry" to get out of trouble. They don't understand making amends. Then you tell them to say it like they mean it. Now we're teaching them that they have to fake sincerity to do an appropriate apology.

    Yet at some point , we learn (or we don't) that an appropriate apology has much more depth to it.

    I gave up forcing an apology out of my kids a few years ago. I try to let them know that I felt their behaviour was inappropriate. I let them know that I feel they owe an apology. But I can't force them to make it. Telling them how an appropriate apology works gives them the foundation to be able to use it when they have the maturity to handle it.

    The exception is when amends can be made for some damage caused. The action of making amends is just as important as the words themselves.
  • Re: Apologies

    Thu, July 3, 2008 - 12:22 PM
    Growing up, my family was awful at apologizing. Family arguements generally ended with either someone giving in because they were tired of hearing about it or someone storming off to their room and locking the door. We knew the arguement was over when whoever stormed off re-entered the room and acted normal. NOT habits I wanted to keep! I was 10 or so when a friend started consistently insisting that I apologize when I had done something wrong and wanted to make up. From that, I learned how to do what I think of as "easy" apologies- the ones where you did something wrong, but it's not emotionally loaded. You know- "Ooops, sorry, I didn't mean to bump into you." and "I am so sorry I broke xyz, it just slipped right out of my hand." Polite apologies, for when you did something on accident, but it affected someone else. I still mean it, but they're not as hard.

    Two big things for me when apologizing is to not apologize when I don't mean it, or for something I don't mean, and to listen to explanations. It drives me nuts to not have people listen to all of what I'm saying, brushing it off as "excuses" when it may be relevant. When I fight with someone close to me these days, we both generally end up apologizing for upsetting the other person, since we don't want to hurt each other. Then we try to figure out a way to fix whatever set us off in the first place, sitting down and working out a compromise. Finally, we do something to reconnect. It might be as simple as a hug or as long as deciding to go out together for dinner.
    • Re: Apologies

      Thu, July 3, 2008 - 12:33 PM
      I often don't bother to offer explanations, and just say I fucked up. If someone is interested in the why of it, they often ask. Otherwise, the important thing to the person is that I acknowledge that I screwed up and what I'm going to do to attempt to fix it (and the request for forgiveness).

      I agree that apologizing when you're not actually sorry is pointless.
      • Re: Apologies

        Fri, July 4, 2008 - 6:09 PM
        "I often don't bother to offer explanations, and just say I fucked up."

        Ha-ha! One of my mental models about a right proper apology is Murphy's former partner in the movie RoboCop. She screws something up and gets her boss chewed out and when he confronts her about it, she's straight and to the point and doesn't weasel out. She says "I fucked up, boss."

        That one slipped out of my mouth in a meeting many years ago, when I was part of a team of people and my assignment had been delayed or I had missed some point. There was a silence at the table, and then everybody cracked up. It actually BROKE the bitchy tension in the room!
  • Re: Apologies

    Thu, July 3, 2008 - 1:05 PM
    For me one of the central issues in an apology is communicating why the mis-action occurred in the first place and why they have decided it was in error. If a person has done a thing to me that they now believe was in error, intentionally or not, I now want to know why that thing was done. Once I understand the reasoning, and see where it has changed, then it is much easier for me to accept what has happened and move on... while watching out for that miscommunication, misconception, logic flaw, etc with that person in the future. I'm big on "Why?"
    If a person is apologizing more because of the effect their actions had upon me (say they said something that upset me a great deal and are apologizing more for the upset than the words) then it is important to me that they listen and understand why my response was what it was so that we can seek to avoid this in the future.
    Because these are the things I look for in an apology this is how I tend to approach my own apologies. This sometimes gets me in trouble with people who want a simple admission of guilt and believe that I am trying to apologize without apologizing by rationalizing my actions.
    • Re: Apologies

      Fri, July 4, 2008 - 6:05 PM
      "This sometimes gets me in trouble with people who want a simple admission of guilt and believe that I am trying to apologize without apologizing by rationalizing my actions."

      Sometimes people don't want an apology. They want a capitulation.
      • Re: Apologies

        Fri, July 4, 2008 - 11:02 PM
        Unfortunately, even when once expresses a sincere desire for restoration of mutual understanding and respect, it can't be demanded - iit has to be offered. So what does the person who wants to move forward do, when the other person involved refuses?
        • Re: Apologies

          Sat, July 5, 2008 - 5:33 PM
          "So what does the person who wants to move forward do, when the other person involved refuses?"

          In that instance, an apology is identical to any other object or action. If I requested more oral sex, for example, and partner wasn't willing to offer it, then I have to decide how important oral sex is to the relationship.

          Same with an apology, and so forth.

          Naturally, this works well when tempered with a reality check.

          If, for example, I honestly believe I am owed an apology, but, say, Noel thinks she did absolutely nothing wrong, then that would be where I'd have to consider just how important that reality check and that apology would be.

          When dating adults who seek to solve problems, this is usually not a huge issue.
          • Re: Apologies

            Sat, July 5, 2008 - 6:54 PM
            "When dating adults who seek to solve problems, this is usually not a huge issue. "

            Ah yes, well one would hope so, but alas....
  • Re: Apologies

    Fri, July 4, 2008 - 6:42 AM
    Be real. Be fast. And be small after because 99 times out of 100 ego was at the root. Remove the ego and the energy which was the root cause is removed.
    • Re: Apologies

      Fri, July 4, 2008 - 2:42 PM
      thank you for reminding me to buy this book, which I just did:

      www.fivelovelanguages.com/learn...y.html

      the 5 love languages i found to be a life-changing book.

      this page about the apology book explains to me, why some apologies work and others do not and what different people are looking for.

      but in general, i do now try to resolve conflicts as they emerge, and then use apologies when appropriate, and then find out what the other person needs so we can do what each other wants (of course as long as it does not cross a boundary that we may have).

      xo

Recent topics in "Polyamory"

Topic Author Replies Last Post
Momentum Edward 3 Today, 4:50 PM
Process percentage Edward 30 Today, 3:51 PM
Playa addresses Kinnari 3 Today, 12:42 PM
Loss of Control miss eeyore 21 Yesterday, 4:16 PM